Holding the Line Through Tear Gas and Censorship
“There is no neutral ground in this moment. You’re either resisting or you’re complicit,” says Eman Abdelhadi.
You’re either on the side that is singing and showing up and holding other people, or you’re on the side of the helicopters and the gas canisters and the guns,” says Eman Abdelhadi. In this episode of “Movement Memos,” Abdelhadi, Maya Schenwar, and host Kelly Hayes discuss immigration raids and the violent repression of protesters in Chicago, the administration’s war on free speech and the organized left, and lessons from the upcoming book, Read This When Things Fall Apart: Letters to Activists in Crisis.
Music by Curved Mirror, David Celeste.
TRANSCRIPT:
Note: This transcript was originally published in Truthout. It is reprinted here with permission.
Kelly Hayes: Welcome to “Movement Memos,” a Truthout podcast about organizing, solidarity, and the work of making change. I’m your host, Kelly Hayes. Today, we are talking about federal attacks on immigrants and protesters in Chicago, and Trump’s ongoing attacks on free speech and expression. We’ll also be discussing my upcoming book, Read This When Things Fall Apart: Letters to Activists in Crisis. Today’s guests are both Chicago-based organizers and authors whose work is featured in the book.
Maya Schenwar is the director of the Truthout Center for Grassroots Journalism and the Board President of Truthout. She’s also the co-editor of the book We Grow the World Together: Parenting Toward Abolition and a co-author of Prison by Any Other Name. Maya is also an organizer with Love and Protect.
Eman Abdelhadi is a scholar and activist who studies gender in Muslim communities in the U.S. Eman is also a Truthout contributor and has a regular column at In These Times. She’s also a co-author of the book, Everything for Everyone: An Oral History of the New York Commune, 2052–2072. Eman organizes with Faculty and Staff for Justice in Palestine at the University of Chicago and with Scholars for Social Justice.
Maya and Eman are brilliant mentors, planners, and movement strategists, and they are also two of my best friends. I am so grateful for the opportunity to share their knowledge and insights with you all, and for the opportunity to make this episode with them. I am quite passionate about making things that are helpful and useful with my friends, which is why we wound up working together on Read This When Things Fall Apart. I hope this discussion about what we’re all up against right now, and about how the book might help, is meaningful to you all during this difficult time.
If you appreciate this podcast, and you would like to support “Movement Memos,” you can subscribe to Truthout’s newsletter or make a donation at truthout.org. You can also support the show by subscribing to “Movement Memos” on Apple or Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts, or by leaving a positive review on those platforms. Sharing episodes on social media is also a huge help.
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[musical interlude]
KH: Maya and Eman, welcome to “Movement Memos.”
Eman Abdelhadi: Thank you. Great to be here.
Maya Schenwar: So glad to be here. Thanks, Kelly.
KH: How are you doing today, friends?
EA: It’s definitely a rough time out here. Yeah.
MS: I would say that I have had better days in my life, but I’m really glad to be with both of you virtually hanging out in our little boxes on Zoom.
EA: Definitely.
KH: I am likewise grateful to be in conversation with you both. I am always excited to learn from the two of you and to hear your insights. You’re also two of my best friends, so anytime we can connect, during these hard times, it does my heart good — even when the subject matter isn’t easy.
So, I am really excited to talk about our upcoming book, Read This When Things Fall Apart: Letters to Activists in Crisis. But first I think we need to talk about some of the crises that we’re presently facing. Eman, I would love to start with you. You and I were recently at a protest together at the Broadview ICE facility near Chicago. For those who don’t know, the Broadview detention center has become an important site of resistance in the Chicagoland area. It’s the main processing center ICE has been using during the massive surge of immigration arrests we’ve seen over the last few weeks. ICE claims to have taken more than 700 people from Chicago and surrounding communities in recent weeks — though that number is currently unconfirmed. The detention center has become a regular site of autonomous protest, as community members attempt to block ICE vehicles, demand freedom for our stolen neighbors, and tell ICE to get the fuck out of Chicagoland. Protesters at Broadview have been met with intense repression including tear gas, pepper balls, and kinetic impact projectiles, such as rubber bullets and so-called sponge grenades. I myself have been struck with pepper balls and overwhelmed by tear gas at these protests. I have witnessed people being arbitrarily brutalized and arrested. About a week ago, I had to flush someone’s eyes with water after they were shot in the head with a pepper ball while they were standing next to me.
It has been nightmarish out there, at times, amid these attacks. So, I wanted to ask, Eman, why did you feel it was important to attend a protest at Broadview, in spite of these risks, and what did you experience or learn on the ground that day?
Eman Abdelhadi: Thank you so much, Kelly. And it was an honor to be on the ground with you and to be in resistance with you. Yeah, I felt that it is deeply important for us to be there because it’s clear that this administration’s strategy is to just push the most horrific developments possible and see what sticks, see what they can get away with. And so the imperative on us to resist is higher than ever. And with this, what’s been happening in Chicago is “Operation Midway Blitz,” which has been a mass deportation operation. Folks have been really focused on the National Guard when it seemed like he was going to deploy the National Guard to Chicago. And then he took that back and people seemed to relax.
But this whole time there has been this massive deportation operation and we’re seeing daily raids. Just yesterday or the day before, there was a raid on a Home Depot in the Chicagoland area that ICE showed up with 25 vehicles to arrest folks. And we’re seeing daily detentions. These people are terrorizing our communities and they’re setting up shop. I mean, in Broadview, ICE has been setting up shop in our backyard. Just brazenly taking up community resources to terrorize this very same community. And so it felt really important to join protesters out there to say, not in our city, not in our name, not in our backyard. This will not go by unnoticed. This will not go by without resistance.
And the goal of these protests is to shut down the facility, and to basically make it as costly as possible for this administration to wage war on our neighbors and our communities. It was very harrowing out there yesterday. I’ve been going to protests since I was 12 years old. I’ve been to countless protests and I think in some ways, this was one of the most brutal because it wasn’t what we usually deal with — which is police that are trained to do crowd control and protest control. The police in Broadview are a very small force and they mostly sort of stayed out of the way. (And for listeners outside the Chicagoland area, Broadview is a village near Chicago. It is not actually part of Chicago.) And instead what we dealt with was just ICE pointing guns at us. Pointing and just shooting at us. Shooting rubber bullets, shooting pepper balls, shooting gas canisters, and even a flash grenade at one point. And it really felt like a war zone. And I think that that’s the reality that we all need to face, is that this administration has waged war on all of us and is treating us as though we are combatants in a war.
There’s no doubt in my mind that those officers at Broadview would’ve shot things that were much more lethal at us if they could. And the question becomes: When will they be authorized to do so? And everything that this administration has been doing suggests that it’s only a matter of time. And so I think that for me, Broadview yesterday represented this new world that we’re facing – a world in which populations like our immigrant neighbors, our undocumented neighbors, are rendered disposable.
And once the powers that be decide they’re disposable, anyone who stands in the way, anyone who dissents, anyone who resists, anyone who dares stand up, is rendered disposable too, and is rendered an enemy of the state. And it’s important always to remember that the state has always treated certain populations like this, but that there has been a marked expansion and a marked flouting of the rules. A sort of almost glee in the level of violence and repression that we’re seeing.
So it’s a scary moment, but it’s also a moment that bears no equivocation, right? At this point you are either on the side of protecting our neighbors and protecting our community, or you’re on the side of this administration. There is no neutral ground in this moment. There’s no center left. You’re either resisting or you’re complicit.
KH: I really appreciate what you’re saying about disposability, because I really believe that’s the culture that Trump and his allies are seeking to impose upon us — one where our neighbors are picked off by federal agents, or die because they lose Medicare, or go hungry because they lose SNAP, and we’re all just meant to keep cooperating, hoping that we don’t get caught up in the worst of it. The status quo of the United States under neoliberalism primed us for this moment, and this moment of fascist acceleration is going to be devastating and annihilatory for a lot of people, and as you’re saying, it must be resisted.
That’s why I think it’s so important that the on-the-ground culture at the Broadview protests really exists in opposition to that mindset of disposability, complicity, and cooperation with fascism. People aren’t just resisting the capture and deportation of our migrant neighbors, which is crucial work — they’re also taking care of each other. While Eman and I were together at Broadview, for example, our friends were distributing gas masks and impact resistant goggles. We were all checking on each other, sharing water, and flushing people’s eyes after chemical attacks. We were comforting each other and singing together. The Songs for Liberation collective was out there, wearing gas masks and playing their instruments on the frontlines. That was also an act of care that made us braver and stronger.
There was even a pop-up workshop at the protest that morning where people learned how to treat tear gas and pepper spray exposure, so they wouldn’t be wholly reliant on street medics when people around them were struggling.
There were moments when the tear gas they launched at us was seeping past my goggles, and I couldn’t see, but I knew that if I was in trouble, someone would take me by the arm and get me to safety. I’m not trying to over-romantize anything, or to say we are successful in all of our efforts to keep each other safe. This is a dangerous site of protest, and people who want to go should arrive understanding that — preferably with their own safety gear, wearing long sleeves and pants, and closed toe shoes. But as unsafe as we were out there, I could feel that we were contributing to the culture of care that needs to exist in opposition to the death-making culture this administration is promoting and forcing upon us.
EA: Yeah, I think there was such a marked… you know, the ferocity of the state… It was so intense, the difference between the ferocity of the state and the violence of the state and the hatred of the state, and the absolute love and joy and resistance and camaraderie among protesters. I was struggling to put my gas mask on, and I just walked up to a random person who was wearing one, and was like, “Can you help me?” And that kind of trust to let someone touch me that I had never met… that sort of, I just know that if you are here and you’re resisting, we are on the same side in the struggle that we’ll probably be in for the rest of our lives, in a struggle against repression and tyranny.
Yeah, so I kept thinking actually yesterday about the sounds at the protest. That on the one hand the sounds were helicopters and gas canisters hitting the ground and flash grenades exploding, and the sounds of gunshots, they weren’t bullets but gunshots, firing at us. And on the other hand, the sound of us singing, “We shall overcome,” even through all of that, and singing, “We are not afraid,” even through all of that and the sounds of people checking on each other, “Are you okay? What do you need?” And the sounds of someone walking around saying, “Water, I have water. Masks, I have masks.” People calling out to medics and medics saying, “I’m here. I’m here.”
The sounds of our people coming unarmed to these protests, armed only with solidarity. Hacking up lungs and coughing and sniffling from the gas. And it just felt like such… these different sounds, I think, felt like such a stark embodiment of these two sides that our world is increasingly being divided into. That you are either on the side that is singing and showing up and holding other people, or you’re on the side of the helicopters and the gas canisters and the guns.
And I felt this has been a moment of such intense despair, especially for me as a Palestinian, watching this genocide. Watching the whole world stand up against this genocide and not being able to end it. And watching this incredible social movement rise up in the U.S. for Palestinian solidarity. Watching us do exactly what we set out to do and changing the minds of Americans. And yet the genocide continuing and expanding in the most horrific ways possible and exceeding any horror.
And in this moment of intense despair, even though yesterday was so harrowing, I was so glad to be there and to be reminded that even in the face of the worst repression, in the face of this tyrannical state, this tyrannical administration, there will always be people that are out there singing and holding signs and putting their bodies on the line. And that felt so re-energizing for me and affirming for me. And that’s the thing that gives me a sort of revolutionary optimism, is knowing that no matter what happens, we are going to continue to try to show up for each other with whatever resources we have.
KH: Speaking of showing up for each other, there was a moment, during that protest at Broadview, when you and I were on a blockade line together, and you had your arm around me, and my back was aching, and my eyes were sore from the tear gas. My eyes, only minutes earlier, had been watering uncontrollably from the tear gas. I was so tired, and in so much pain, but being there with you, feeling your arm around me, and seeing all of those brave people in the street, there was nowhere else in the world that I wanted to be. I felt like I was exactly where I was supposed to be, doing what I was supposed to do, with the people I was meant to do it with. And that’s not about perfection, or everyone doing everything in exactly the right way, but about feeling a sense of communion around our shared values, and what we owe to each other. I think we need moments like that, whether they occur in the context of a risky protest, or something more solemn or artful — people need moments that remind them of who they are, who they want to be, and who they want to be to each other. And we have to cultivate those moments.
We can also do that under safer circumstances. And I want to acknowledge that not everyone can attend protests as dangerous as the demonstrations at Broadview. This has been a very risky space for attendees. There was a moment the other day when folks were trying to stop an ICE vehicle, and people were putting their hands on the SUV’s hood, trying to hold their ground, and the SUV just kept pushing into them. People scrambled to avoid falling and winding up under the vehicle. They were risking their lives. And this was not unusual for that site. This is an ongoing occurrence. Then, there are all the less lethal munitions, which can sometimes cause lasting damage. Rubber and foam bullets can break bones, and cause internal organ damage. People can lose their vision. Tear gas can cause miscarriages, and repeated exposure can cause lung damage. People can get burned by chemical canisters that are launched at them, and historically, some people have died due to traumatic brain injuries, after being struck with tear gas canisters. There is a reason tear gas is banned as a weapon of war, and yet it’s used freely on protesters.
We obviously need people who are willing to face those risks in these times — even though we may fail to stop the ICE vehicle in front of us, or close that detention center immediately, because we have to embody our values and enact our refusal, amid fascist violence. But I know not everyone can be in those environments.
Which is why I want to remind folks that there are so many ways to contribute. Hundreds of people in Chicago are part of rapid response networks that are responding to ICE watch calls, monitoring hotspots, and trying to form a crowd and get loud when ICE agents appear in their communities or attempt to detain someone.
There are people and businesses that are delivering groceries to folks who don’t feel safe leaving their homes. There are barbers who are making house calls. There are so many ways to play a role in defending a community under siege. And each and every one of those roles really matters. So while I would love to see more people at the Broadview protests, I want us to keep welcoming people into every form of action that they can take. We need more people, and we need to extend meaningful invitations that help people find their place in our movements, whatever that looks like. We need a beautiful culture of care and resistance to help sustain us through these times.
EA: Yeah, absolutely. I recently joined… I live in a largely Latino neighborhood that is an immigrant neighborhood, Pilsen. And I recently joined the rapid response efforts here, and it’s just incredible what folks have been able to do and set up. And there are so many ways to plug in that don’t necessarily involve direct confrontations with the state, but that are crucial to the survival of the rapid response efforts. And if you are in the Pilsen area, I recommend that you get in touch with PUñO, or follow PUñO on Instagram. But also I know that ICIRR [the Illinois Coalition for Immigrant and Refugee Rights] and OCAD [Organized Communities Against Deportations] have been putting on trainings and can plug folks into rapid response teams based on their neighborhood.
KH: Yes, the Illinois Coalition for Immigrant and Refugee Rights and OCAD, Organized Communities Against Deportations, have been putting on regular workshops for folks who want to get more involved in rapid response efforts. And we’ll be sure to include links to all of that in the show notes. Maya, as a Chicago organizer, would you like to share a bit about what you’ve been seeing and feeling around the grassroots response to “Operation Midway Blitz”?
MS: Yeah, definitely. It has been really heartening to see efforts in my neighborhood as well, in Rogers Park, and people building on previous networks that have existed between organizers, but even among blocks. People who met each other at block parties are getting together to say, “Let’s attend an ICE watch training together. Let’s attend a rapid response training. Let’s think together about ways we can support our neighbors.” I’ve seen networks emerging organically at my kid’s school and in my specific neighborhood and just among friends. I’m seeing interfaith coalitions emerging and solidifying around preventing deportations among people teaching each other, doing informal political education, learning how to respond to ICE.
And I think this is heartening not only because people are getting trained up in larger numbers, but because people are being activated who were not before. And that’s important in responding to this specific moment. But it’s also important in building networks of care that are going to be important for us in all kinds of different contexts as we move forward.
And on the subject of the Broadview protests, I am so heartened and grateful that people are resisting in this way. That people are directly intervening on the ground, putting their bodies on the line. Everybody has a different lane in this moment, and sometimes those lanes are overlapping — people have multiple lanes. But in addition to people doing behind the scenes care work, in addition to people accompanying kids to kindergarten, in addition to doing mutual aid in our neighborhoods, we need people willing to put their bodies on the line, people willing to support each other as they’re taking risks and taking direct action. So I just want to express my gratitude and my full support for the folks at Broadview.
KH: While protesters at Broadview are facing violent repression, our movements, communities, and freedoms are also being threatened in other ways. Maya, you recently co-wrote a powerful piece on the administration’s attacks on the press and free expression. Can you explain how these attacks fit into an authoritarian playbook that predates this moment, and share a bit of your perspective on how we got here?
MS: Absolutely. So since the killing of Charlie Kirk, we’ve seen this sharp escalation in the Trump administration’s overt repression of speech and expression. And we’ve seen how the administration is promising to go after left-wing groups and funders, based on some instances of people simply challenging the idea that Charlie Kirk is leaving some shining beautiful legacy. So we now see things like new restrictions on journalists covering the Pentagon that say that those journalists are going to lose their access if they don’t sign a pledge, promising not to gather information that the Pentagon hasn’t explicitly approved for release.
And we saw the temporary, but I would argue still significant, suspension of Jimmy Kimmel, the mainstream TV host, in direct response to the Trump administration’s threats toward a media company. And we’ve also heard administration officials like Pam Bondi, the Attorney General, saying that the administration is going to pursue prosecution for, quote/unquote, hate speech. So basically threats to violate the First Amendment in this supposed emergency.
Then I’m sure people have heard Trump signed this executive order declaring Antifa, broadly referring to left movements really, as a so-called domestic terrorist organization. And there’s no legal framework for that domestic terrorist designation. So it’s not exactly clear what this does, but the point isn’t necessarily to change the law, it’s to open the door for more overreach and to give cover for authoritarian actions. And in using the term “terrorist” the administration is, I think, attempting to invoke a kind of wartime mentality. And in that kind of mentality, it’s acceptable for the usual rules and limits to fall away.
So a couple of days after that Antifa executive order, Trump actually released a presidential memorandum, which is basically threatening a very broad whole government crackdown on left networks under the guise of cracking down on political violence. So you see how this term political violence is just being used in this sprawling way right now. And one component of this is an attack on nonprofits and funders who are, “aiding and abetting” the activities that the administration claims to be targeting.
So we don’t know how this will be implemented. We don’t know exactly what will be repressed, what will be prosecuted, but it’s worth being concerned about how it might expand prosecutions. And about the targeting and, potentially, attempts at dismantling nonprofit organizations and funders on the left.
So you asked what got us here, and I just want to point out that this slew of executive actions is not simply some kind of passionate, spontaneous response to Charlie Kirk’s killing. And that’s very much the way the right is portraying it, is like this outrage at this killing, this deep grief and mourning, and then a policy response or a declarative response. But when it comes to crackdowns on free expression and left movements, the administration and the right, as a whole, have been waiting for the opportune moment to strike. They’ve had the playbooks, and I’m sure “Movement Memos” listeners likely know about Project 2025 [and] Project Esther. And in our op-ed, Negin [Owliaei] and I also mentioned this long playbook that came out last year by the Capital Research Center, which is another influential right-wing think tank with ties to the Heritage Foundation.
And this playbook discusses plans to dismantle the ecosystem of left and progressive institutions. And they talk about it specifically in relation to organizing around Palestine. They definitely want to target that, but it also touches a whole bunch of other corners of the left. And it very closely resembles the administration’s current language around tearing down left infrastructure. And it maps out tools for doing that and targeting not only organizers and activist groups, but also funders as we’ve been hearing a lot about lately, and legal aid organizations, advocacy organizations. So many of the puzzle pieces that make up our infrastructure on the left.
And it’s worth noting also that the Capital Research Center came out with a new report on September 17th, and that report focuses on George Soros, and mapping the network of groups that it says he funds or is connected to, and it calls them terrorist organizations. So these playbooks and these plans should remind us that the right has studied the left. They have strategically mapped out their tactics and their moves aren’t coming out of nowhere. So on the left, we have to take these threats seriously. We can’t dismiss them even if they’re sometimes framed in ridiculous terms. And we really have to work to understand where they’re coming from. And we also have to draw on our own playbooks. We have to draw on our ability to map things and strategize, and we have to work together to move forward.
And I was thinking this morning about how the right, and the administration specifically, are framing up this vast conspiracy theory around left-wing networks and about how we’re all connected to each other. About how we’re in communication, we’re in relationship, and they are very threatened by our connections. And actually, I think that’s where our power lies. Our power lies in our connections and our relationships. And so rather than shrinking from them or severing them because of the right, outlining their conspiracy theories and talking about our networks, we need to work toward more connection.
We need to work toward deeper relationships, more care for each other, better communication on the left. And I think that’s one powerful form of defiance. And then luckily, strengthening our connections and building new connections, is also how we build the world that we actually want to live in.
KH: Eman, I really want to invite you to chime in here, in terms of this question about how we got here, because attacks on free speech, as it relates to Palestine, have obviously helped set the table for this moment.
EA: Yeah, I mean, scholars have talked about this as the Palestine exception to free speech, and it’s really reigned for decades that even when we have been in moments with relatively low attacks on free speech, there has always been an exception for Palestine. And we saw that really ramp up after the beginning of the genocide in 2023. The escalation of protests against that genocide. We saw really every institution in this country double and triple down on this exception. And thousands have gotten arrested or fired or beaten or censored in various ways.
And what Palestinians have always said is, if this exception exists for us, then no one’s right to free speech is actually safe. And we are seeing that play out now. We’re seeing the playbook of what has been applied to Palestinians apply to other people. And I want to say that the exception made for Palestinians is also not unique. That exception has also existed for the Black freedom struggle and for Indigenous struggles. And those communities also warned that if those exceptions exist, then they are only going to expand. Then leaving these openings for the state will only mean that everybody is vulnerable. And we’re really seeing that here in this moment.
And I want to say that this same logic of exception applies to many things. Many of the rules that were instituted during the so-called War on Terror are also threatening everyone’s liberties. And we have said this from the beginning. I want to emphasize that these attacks on free speech have not been unique to this administration. That in fact, the Biden administration also sanctioned and expanded a crackdown on free speech around Palestine, really opened the door for the further expansion that the Trump administration is going through.
What we are seeing is this liberal… We’re seeing liberal commentators say that the cancellation of Jimmy Kimmel was the biggest attack on free speech that they had seen. Meanwhile, just a few months ago, we were watching people get… Rümeysa Öztürk was literally detained for writing an op-ed. So if we can’t name this, anyone who can’t name the pattern, truly name the pattern, is not going to be at the forefront of actually fighting for our free speech and our civil liberties.
We cannot trust someone who can’t name Mahmoud Khalil or the various student protesters who have been repressed as part of this pattern. If it starts with Jimmy Kimmel for you, then you do not see the problem and you are not equipped to address it.
KH: In terms of having and developing the analysis we need to address this moment, I think we have to talk about what’s become of the press under this administration. Legacy publications, centrist commentators, and the corporate press have largely capitulated to fascism in a manner that is downright stunning, despite my low expectations. Those failures make independent media more important than ever. I obviously believe in Truthout, which is the publication behind this podcast, that Maya and I both work for, but we don’t just need one trusted publication right now. We are facing opponents that are tearing at the fabric of our shared reality, who want to make the truth indistinguishable from their hoaxes, myths, and lies. To combat that, we need to understand the truth as a front of struggle, and we need to fortify that front. Because the truth doesn’t need a singular champion, it needs an ecosystem of people and publications who are committed to keeping it alive. Maya, you’ve been doing some work around building the relationships, connections, and support systems that can sustain that kind of ecosystem. Can you talk a bit about that?
MS: Yeah, definitely. So a couple of years ago, I launched the Truthout Center for Grassroots Journalism, and it’s a project that supports a range of social justice-driven media organizations. So often we operate in our little silos and we try to reinvent the wheel, and we don’t have time to do that on the left right now, or [the] resources. And so the Truthout Center for Grassroots Journalism is a mentorship project, in part, it’s a commitment to use the lessons that Truthout has gathered over the past 24 years to support other media organizations in things like fundraising, in things like protecting themselves, digital security, creating editorial processes. All the things that we need to do to be a force for power and change on the left.
And then simultaneously, we’re one of the founding members of the Movement Media Alliance, which is a coalition of, I think now 22 grassroots aligned journalism organizations. And we are working together to build a media movement on the left that is a component of that larger project of both pushing back against fascism and also helping to build the world, the world that we want to live in. And we came together because we saw what was on the horizon, and media was in a crisis moment, not only because no one had enough money and organizations were dying and falling apart, but also because we saw that media is one of the critical targets of any rising fascism. Media is how people find out the truth, in part.
And so protecting the truth is a vital anti-fascist project, and we can only really do that together. None of us is a vast conglomerate, so we need to relationship-build. We need to support each other and have each other’s backs. And so we’ve just been getting together among media on the left and figuring out how to creatively do that.
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KH: As Eman spoke about Palestine, I found myself thinking about the letters you both wrote for our upcoming book, Read This When Things Fall Apart: Letters to Activists in Crisis. For those who don’t know, this book is a care package of sorts, created by a number of organizers, activists, and thinkers, most of whom are good friends and trusted co-strugglers of mine. It’s a book full of letters addressed to activists and organizers experiencing a variety of challenges, disasters, and heartbreaks. I wrote the first and last letters in the book, and also served as the book’s editor, helping people find the focus of their letters and edit them. The book’s table of contents reads like a crisis directory for people experiencing some of the struggles and setbacks that are not only part of organizing for justice, but also consequences of caring about the world and the people we share it with.
I loved both of your letters so much, and I think the words you both shared are going to be so helpful to so many people.
Eman, I would love to start by talking about your letter, which is so poignant and beautiful. Can you say a bit about who you were hoping to reach with that letter and what you were hoping to communicate?
EA: Yeah. I wrote the letter in February of 2024, so just a few months into the genocide. And the strange thing is that things have gotten so much worse. And that moment was this moment of incredible shock. And the theme of the letter is around living kind of between two realities. On the one hand, you might be living this life in the U.S. or wherever, and everything around you seems to be proceeding as normal, but you know that all is not right in the world. As you’re watching on your screen just utter destruction and horror that your own tax dollars are paying for.
So I write this letter to sort of say how do you deal with this kind of dual reality and how do you proceed through these moments of absolute shock and where your nervous system is completely thrown off and where reality feels very difficult to grasp? And I think we haven’t exited that moment. In fact, there have been just new unfathomable layers added every day. It’s strange to me that I live in a neighborhood that I walk around in and feel safe in and that I absolutely adore, knowing that my neighbors are being abducted. They’re being abducted every single day in my neighborhood. It’s not even far away geographically the way Gaza is.
So the letter is hoping to kind of reach that moment and to say, okay, how do we deal with this intense anxiety and trauma, but keep moving and keep working? Because the urgency of the moment demands that we set these things aside. And so I offer some suggestions from my own experience writing in the fifth month of the genocide.
KH: Your letter is such an important intervention and I am so grateful for it.
Maya, your letter about experiencing a sense of alienation from your community as an anti-Zionist Jewish person protesting the genocide in Gaza feels so important right now. I knew when you and I discussed this potential theme for your letter that this was going to be an important message, not only for Jewish people who oppose Israel’s heinous actions in Palestine, but for so many others who are going to feel alienated and alone as the people around them acquiesce and capitulate in the face of injustice.
We are living in a time when fascist politics are being normalized, white-washed, celebrated, and sometimes reduced to “differing opinions” that we simply have to learn how to live with. For people of conscience, this is disorienting and disheartening, to say the least. Can you talk about this theme of alienation and how we hold onto our values, and our sense of who we are in relation to other people amid so much injustice?
MS: Definitely. Thank you, Kelly. It’s such a big question and such an important one.
I wrote my essay in the earlier part of this escalated stage of genocide in early 2024, and I was writing about the alienation of many anti-Zionist Jews from the broader mainstream Jewish institutions, from people they grew up with, and often from family members. And for me, the antidote to these alienations was threefold. And I think it does apply much more broadly to those questions you raised in terms of alienation from really mainstream culture at this time of fascist normalization.
So one, it’s crucial to ground ourselves in our actual solidarities as opposed to our imagined communities, so, like Americans or American Jews. So the question more is who are our people? And in my essay, I was exploring how my people are those who are struggling for justice and liberation. Obviously we’re all doing that imperfectly, often in conflict, not to romanticize. But yes, my people are those who are struggling for justice and liberation including and especially Palestinian liberation. And there’s so many of us. None of us are alone.
And then simultaneously, so often when we’re in a place of existential anguish thinking, “Who the fuck am I right now?” which is one of the central questions of alienation, it’s good to flip that and ask, “What the fuck am I doing?”
And in my essay I quote Mariame [Kaba], from your book, Kelly, Let This Radicalize You. And she says, “The most important thing you can do to transform the world is to act.” So kind of shifting from that kind of circular, self-oriented logic to the outward, the action.
Another antidote to alienation is to draw from our tradition and from our ancestors. And I know this doesn’t work for everybody. Some people’s ancestors just fully suck. And their antidote to alienation might be about creating wholly new traditions. And of course, let’s not romanticize. Nobody’s ancestors are perfect. But sometimes, drawing on the parts of our lineages that make sense to us and relinquishing others can bring us into harmony and drive us to action in ways that feel especially grounding and meaningful when we’re feeling alienated.
So for me, over the past week actually, I’ve been drawing from this so much because as I see people being fired and targeted merely for saying what Charlie Kirk’s beliefs were, I’m thinking about how my Jewish ancestors were communists and rabble-rousers. Some of them were firm anti-Zionists. And my grandfather was investigated and interrogated by the loyalty committee during the McCarthy era, lost his job, had to move his family. The other side of my family was targeted in other ways during that Red Scare. And I’m drawing from my ancestors’ courage in that moment, from that component of their legacy. And remembering that history isn’t just a thing that’s written in books, and intergenerational memory isn’t just a traumatic thing, it can also give us strength.
And then finally, I think you asked, how do we hold our values in relation to other people amid so much injustice? And with the risk of some eye rolls, I think the last part of my own response to this is just love. It’s cheesy, but it’s real. And in my piece for the anthology, I quote Rebecca Vilkomerson and Rabbi Alissa Wise, who write that we can practice solidarity as an expression of love. And that that love manifests with rage at the world as it is, while developing concrete plans to realize the world as it should be. And they say that love and solidarity live in the both/and.
So today as we’re recording this, actually it’s Rosh Hashanah, the Jewish New Year. And on Rosh Hashanah, the tradition is to pray like the whole world is hanging in the balance. Will we and will the world survive another year, is the question. And at this time, in our radical Jewish tradition, it’s not about fate. It’s about us recognizing our responsibility to actively work to sustain the world another year and to work to transform it and to be driven by our solidarities and driven by love.
KH: May we all take up that task.
We all wrote the letters in Read This When Things Fall Apart some time ago. So, I’m wondering, if you were writing a letter today to an activist in the thick of everything we’re dealing with right now, is there something you would say that you didn’t say in your letter that’s featured in the book? Is there a message you’d like to send, here and now, to an activist or organizer in crisis?
EA: I would say that one of the things… Like I said, I wrote the letter five months in, and here we are two years later, just absolutely horrified by where we’ve come. And I think a section I would add would be about pacing and figuring out how to fit long-term organizing and long-term struggle into your life. And that includes taking breaks. That includes figuring out which of the actions you specifically can contribute to in ways that other people can’t. Or what your resources are that you can put on the line. We can’t all be everywhere. And this goes back to this question of there are so many issues calling our attention, even when we know that the enemy across the board is the same. So you have to understand that. You can’t be at every protest. You can’t be at every direct action. You can’t be at every meeting, every assembly. The question is which ones are the best use of your time?
So if you come to think of yourself, your time, and your energy as a movement resource, then you can start to really ask, “Okay, how do I maximize this movement resource? If my time and my energy are a movement resource, where would the movement benefit the most from my presence, from my work, from my intervention?”
And that’s really a question that each of us needs to ask ourselves and is really crucial, because you just can’t do it all. We are going to be in struggle for the rest of our lives. We need to strap in. And I say this all the time, that even if we freed Palestine tomorrow, I would hope that we would all still be in struggle, because there’s a whole world to fight for. There is so much between us and liberation. So how to make sure that you set up your life in a way that you can remain in struggle for the rest of your life and not burn out, I think is really worth addressing and is really worth digging into.
MS: Oh my gosh, I love that. That’s beautiful.
Yeah. If I were to write a letter right now or if I were to add to my letter, I think I would say something about joy. I think I would say that in addition to struggling for justice every day, we need actual fun. And I’m struggling to practice that myself. But one of my favorite podcasts to listen to, in addition to “Movement Memos” obviously, is Imara Jones’ podcast, the TransLash podcast, which includes interviews with trans people and allies about what’s most urgent politically and how we can push back. And in every episode, Imara includes a moment of trans joy. Like she starts the episode saying, “Even now, we’re going to have some trans joy. And here’s a trans person rowing across the Pacific Ocean to raise money for Doctors without Borders,” or some other instance of inspiration or joy or playfulness.
And right after Trump was inaugurated, my partner and I decided that we would have dance parties in our living room several nights a week after our kid went to bed. And anyone could drop in. Sometimes it was just us, but we kept it up for a few months, and now it’s fallen off. And part of that is due to just feeling ground down by fascism, frankly. We’re so exhausted at the end of the night. And we’ve talked about getting it started again though. And I think that part of that is because gathering is an antidote, and part of it is because, as my partner said last night, dancing reminds you what life is about.
And I know that so many “Movement Memos” listeners are working so hard to push back against fascism in all its forms and to build the world we want to live in. And I guess I just also wish for everyone to seek these ways to sustain ourselves along the way. I know that that can sound kind of fuzzy and obvious, but I’ve been struggling with it myself, and I think it’s worth it to keep seeking that sustenance to both allow ourselves to keep going, and also to remind ourselves what we’re fighting for, because we’re fighting for life.
KH: I love and appreciate both of those answers so much. What Eman is saying about how we care for and maintain ourselves, and make sure we can stay in it for the long haul — those are reminders I need personally, right now. But I will say, I am about a hundred times better than I used to be about honoring my needs, and being present for my loved ones, during moments of relentless struggle. Years ago, I used to just grind myself down to the point of collapse, and then I would go through these periods of burnout when I really wasn’t useful to anyone, and would then have a lot of physical and emotional damage to contend with, as a result of all of that neglect. I don’t move that way anymore, for a lot of good reasons, but I do sometimes get caught up, and maybe start neglecting my therapy exercises — which becomes a real problem for my back and my bad shoulder. Or I might not make time for what nourishes me emotionally or spiritually — and that includes joy. I am really grateful that I have people in my life who can help me catch myself, and create space for those things that I might let get away from me, when my anxiety and my task-focused mindset take hold. When Maya and I go for walks by the lake, I’m not only getting exercise that my body really needs, and grounding myself in my connection to the water, but also laughing my ass off because we talk shit about everything. We sometimes talk about very serious things, but we also laugh a lot, because we have to. When Eman and I spend hours watching “Deep Space Nine,” and use my culinary torch to make s’mores in my living room, because city-dwellers have to improvise, there is joy, and rest, and catharsis, and all of it is so necessary.
And we need to make time for the things that lift us up, or enliven us, or that make us feel whole or held right now. We aren’t less entitled to any of that when things feel bleak. If anything, every moment of joy and connection becomes more precious and essential in bleak times. I want all of us to think about what nourishes us, and whether we’re getting enough of it, because it’s not easy to be here, in our movements, in this society, or in this world right now.
That’s why this book is set up like a crisis directory. We know it’s really hard to be here right now, and to be a person who is trying to make things better. We wanted to make something that would help people stay in our movements, but also help people stay in this world. Because it is not easy, right now, to be a person who cares deeply about neighbors who could be deported or displaced, or to face deportation, displacement, or incarceration yourself. It is not easy to bear witness to atrocity, and give everything you have to stop it, only to see those nightmares continue to unfold. It is not easy to contemplate what the future might hold for any of us under fascism, or in the face of climate catastrophes. It is not easy to rage against what threatens us and everything we love, day in, day out — or to feel outmatched and outgunned when the whole world is at stake. I see the weight of those feelings breaking people.
So, in organizing this project — and this book really does feel like something that I organized, rather than something I “edited” — I really hoped we could offer the kind of advice, accompaniment, and insight that might help people stay, in the struggle, and here on earth, in our communities, where they’re needed and where they belong. I think our contributors really rose to that task. Collective survival is, by definition, a group project, and so is this book. And I hope it helps you all navigate some of the challenges you’re facing, whether you’re struggling to find some joy, or process your grief, or grappling with access concerns, or the collapse of a friendship or organization. Isolation can be deadly, and sometimes we need help contemplating what it means to find our people, or to even believe that’s possible, if it hasn’t happened yet, or if people we used to believe in have disappointed us.
So, if you’ve been feeling overwhelmed lately, like I have, I hope you’ll find Read This When Things Fall Apart helpful, and that it will be a resource you can return to, again and again, when things get hard. I really think of this book as a care package that my friends and I made for you all, and in about a month, it will start arriving in bookstores and on people’s doorsteps, and I really can’t wait, because I think this book is needed, right now, and that it can’t get here soon enough. Also, if you preorder through my favorite bookstore, Pilsen Community Books, you will get an extra letter from me, tucked in your book. I just wrote that letter this week, and I think some people may find it useful. You can also donate a copy of the book to an activist in need, through a link that AK Press has created, and we’ll be sure to include that in the show notes of this episode.
Maya and Eman, as we wrap things up, is there anything else that you all would like to share with or ask of the audience today?
EA: Just keep yourself and each other safe and stay in the struggle.
MS: Just a lot of gratitude for this conversation and for the people listening, because listening is also an action. It’s a way of staying engaged. It’s a way of motivating yourself and contemplating and reflecting and connecting, and so gratitude all around.
KH: I also want to express my gratitude for you both, of course, for this conversation, but also just for being in my life, and for being my dear friends who I get to laugh and cry and sing with. I am grateful every day to be in the struggle with both of you, and I love you both.
EA: I love you, Kelly.
MS: Right back at you both.
[Musical interlude]
KH: As we close the show today, I just want to extend my love and solidarity to everyone who is defending their communities against the violence of fascism and federal aggression. Whether your city is experiencing the kind of onslaught that folks in cities like Chicago and New York are facing, or if you’re bracing and preparing for what’s to come, we are all in this together. As the recently departed revolutionary Assata Shakur told us, “We must love each other and support each other.”
If you’re a mess right now, I get it. I am, too. I know that it feels like everything is happening all at once, and some of us are exhausted, while also feeling like nothing we do is enough. That’s because it isn’t. And if you were responsible for fixing this mess, all on your own, the fact that what you’re doing isn’t enough would be catastrophic. But liberation, collective survival, and transformation are the work of movements. So take a breath and know that if you are doing what you can, where you are, your work matters. Every ICE watch matters. Every rapid response team matters. Every grocery delivery, every child walked to school, every workshop and protest. It all fucking matters, even though it’s not enough. Fascism is not just normalized, it is becoming the dominant cultural force in our lives, and that means we are building and fortifying a whole counterculture of action, love, and purpose for a real opposition to inhabit. That counterculture has so many moving parts — from artistry to care work to acts of refusal and resistance — and they all matter.
So do your part, and invite others to do it with you. And if your lane isn’t right for someone, help them find theirs. We need a whole lot of people, who aren’t presently in the struggle, to experience fellowship, and to build the confidence they need to believe that by pooling our capacities, we can make a difference. Welcoming people to that journey, again and again, is what is going to help make all of our respective efforts add up to something transformative. That’s how we get to enough.
Remember, not everything we do will immediately stop or start something. So much of what we do is about keeping hope alive, and helping people find their way into something larger than themselves — so that we actually have the collective potential to make change.
We need to invite each other, welcome each other, and help people stay. And we need that sense of communion that Eman and I were talking about earlier, whether we find it at an art build, through a mutual aid project, by doing campaign work, or in the streets, when we square off with those who would harm us. So keep learning, keep trying, and keep connecting. I promise, we’re worth it.
I want to thank our listeners for joining us today, and remember, our best defense against cynicism is to do good, and to remember that the good we do matters. Until next time, I’ll see you in the streets.
Show Notes
- You can preorder Read This When Things Fall Apart: Letters to Activists in Crisis through Kelly’s favorite bookstore or AK Press. (Preorders from these links will include the bonus letter Kelly mentioned. The book is also available for preorder wherever you get your books.)
- You can donate a copy of Read This When Things Fall Apart to an activist in need here.
- You can find the Capital Research report Maya referenced and its recent followup here and here.
- If you live in Chicago, you can sign up for volunteer opportunities with Organized Communities Against Deportation here.
- You can read the article Maya authored with Negin Owliaei about Trump’s crackdown on expression and the organized left here.
- If you are organizing to defend your community against federal aggression— or would like to — you may find Kelly’s Mapping Community Defense and Care in Our Neighborhoods worksheet useful.
- You can check out photos and more of Kelly’s on-the-ground coverage of the Broadview protests here.
